Automatic rifles/(or pistols)
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  1. #1
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    Automatic rifles/(or pistols)

    I was chatting with the young range master at the Bass Pro range the other day. He is looking at buying a suppressor/silencer for his AK semi rifle. We discussed the need to buy a tax stamp for it, which I have read, and the very strict rules about it (since it falls under the old 1930s federal "gangster" law).

    I mentioned that I thought you could also do that with an automatic such as a AR15 with a full auto switch. He said no you can't possess a full auto rifle short of being military/law enforcement.

    Is that true? I was thinking there had been conversations here about the ability to have one if you got the tax stamp. He said no to the full auto even with a tax stamp.

    Anyone agree or disagree?


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    You are right, he is on crack.

    It is a NFA Class3 weapon.

    Google it. Also, I do beleive these weapons to be seriously expensive.

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    The National Firearms Act of 1934 (NFA) was created during the heyday of the American gangsters. I believe it was meant to be a way to deny normal people (meaning the non rich) from owning or possessing machine guns. The $200.00 tax stamp was considered a fortune when people were making a dollar a day digging ditches or farming trying to feed their families.

    Prior to this, Thompson machine guns for example could be purchased by mail order.

    That law was changed May 19, 1986. With this change anything registered before that date could be transferred from one individual to another by filling out the paperwork and paying the tax stamp fee. Those guns are now called "transferable".

    This new change in the law made "new manufacture" of any full automatic firearm prohibited to everyone except the military and police agencies. Those are called "post 86 and only transferable to dealers or military or police agencies. When this happened, the transferable full auto prices started to climb because there were no more to be created for civilian ownership.

    A Colt M-16 that could be purchased for $400.00 plus a $200.00 tax before the law changed (transferable) now costs in the neighborhood of 20-30k.
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  5. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fyrtwuck View Post
    The National Firearms Act of 1934 (NFA) was created during the heyday of the American gangsters. I believe it was meant to be a way to deny normal people (meaning the non rich) from owning or possessing machine guns. The $200.00 tax stamp was considered a fortune when people were making a dollar a day digging ditches or farming trying to feed their families.

    Prior to this, Thompson machine guns for example could be purchased by mail order.

    That law was changed May 19, 1986. With this change anything registered before that date could be transferred from one individual to another by filling out the paperwork and paying the tax stamp fee. Those guns are now called "transferable".

    This new change in the law made "new manufacture" of any full automatic firearm prohibited to everyone except the military and police agencies. Those are called "post 86 and only transferable to dealers or military or police agencies. When this happened, the transferable full auto prices started to climb because there were no more to be created for civilian ownership.

    A Colt M-16 that could be purchased for $400.00 plus a $200.00 tax before the law changed (transferable) now costs in the neighborhood of 20-30k.
    Ok, thanks for the info! What I understand from what you said is that any "full auto" gun manufactured after said date, 1986 cannot be owned by a civilian with the purchase of a tax stamp, but that civilian could potentially own an older automatic rifle with proper papers. (?).

    That seems to make sense to me since I thought that I have heard of individuals owning an AR15 type rifle with full auto. I assume that means that it was a pre-1986 gun.

    Which explains why the cost has gone up so much on these rare guns!

    My friend at the range was specifically talking about a suppressor, so I assume that 1986 rule did not apply to suppressors but only to automatic firearms.


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    The desire for NFA products have jumped skyward in recent years. If you have the bucks, a full auto can be had. Check websites like subguns dot com for a list of items for sale.

    You can ""make" things like a short barreled rifle (SBR)
    A short barreled shotgun (SBS)
    A silencer. All with a Form-1. The "making fee is $200.00. To transfer an item already registered it transfers on a Form-4.

    Then there is a catorgory of "Any other weapon" (AOW). For instance a pen gun, a shotgun with a pistol grip and a barrel less than 18" and overall length of less than 26". To make one, it cost $200.00 and $5.00 for a transfer.

    Next is the Destructive device category (DD). I know little about this category except it covers things like cannons, mortars and grenade launchers.

    Some PD's have full autos in their cars that are issued to the officers. They do NOT belong to the officer. If the officer leaves rhe department, the weapon must be turned in.
    Last edited by Fyrtwuck; 11-07-2016 at 05:43 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by haysmclean View Post
    Ok, thanks for the info! What I understand from what you said is that any "full auto" gun manufactured after said date, 1986 cannot be owned by a civilian with the purchase of a tax stamp, but that civilian could potentially own an older automatic rifle with proper papers. (?).

    That seems to make sense to me since I thought that I have heard of individuals owning an AR15 type rifle with full auto. I assume that means that it was a pre-1986 gun.

    Which explains why the cost has gone up so much on these rare guns!

    My friend at the range was specifically talking about a suppressor, so I assume that 1986 rule did not apply to suppressors but only to automatic firearms.

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    That is correct. Suppressors are still legal to possess and own (as long as they are legal in your state.) The NFA rules still apply and the forms are required for legal possession/ownership.

    The penalty for illegal possession of any NFA item is a felony with a $250,000.00 fine and ten years in prison.
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    President Trump needs to roll back the 1986 ban on full-auto weapons. That would boost rifle and ammo sales.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nickndfl View Post
    president trump needs to roll back the 1986 ban on full-auto weapons. That would boost rifle and ammo sales.
    oh i so wish!
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  10. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by nickndfl View Post
    President Trump needs to roll back the 1986 ban on full-auto weapons. That would boost rifle and ammo sales.
    Actually take it farther back than that and repeal the NFA of 1934 itself.

    The only problem with that repeal would be protests from long term investors and collectors who have been sitting on their collections and watching them grow for years. Not to mention the dealers who are heavy hitters that specialize in NFA products. They would lose millions in investments.
    Last edited by Fyrtwuck; 11-08-2016 at 10:00 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fyrtwuck View Post
    Actually take it farther back than that and repeal the NFA of 1934 itself.

    The only problem with that repeal would be protests from long term investors and collectors who have been sitting on their collections and watching them grow for years. Not to mention the dealers who are heavy hitters that specialize in NFA products. They would lose millions in investments.
    Yes, I believe that is exactly right. There is too much money to be lost by a few. They will raise a big fuss!


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